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		<title><![CDATA[JRRVF - Tolkien en Version Française - Forum / LOTR  vs Iraq : détente]]></title>
		<link>https://www.jrrvf.com/fluxbb/viewtopic.php?id=1793</link>
		<description><![CDATA[Les sujets les plus récents dans LOTR  vs Iraq : détente.]]></description>
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			<title><![CDATA[Réponse à&#160;:  LOTR  vs Iraq : détente]]></title>
			<link>https://www.jrrvf.com/fluxbb/viewtopic.php?pid=10044#p10044</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p> Personnellement,je trouve ce texte assez humoristique. C'est vrai que si on se placait d'un point de vue différent de celui des hobbits,et du reste de la communauté,l'utilité de cette guerre contre Sauron pourrait paraître douteuse. <br> C'est surement possible d'en ecrire dans le même genre,avec le point de vue elfe par exemple,considérant que toute l'idée de cette opération consistait à se débarasser de facon xénophobe des elfes....<br> Evidemment,c'est une projection de l'idée de média dans le monde de Tolkien.</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (peregrin took)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Sun, 19 Mar 2006 16:36:00 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://www.jrrvf.com/fluxbb/viewtopic.php?pid=10044#p10044</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Réponse à&#160;:  LOTR  vs Iraq : détente]]></title>
			<link>https://www.jrrvf.com/fluxbb/viewtopic.php?pid=10041#p10041</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>Franchement je suis d'accord. Le Gondor n'a rien des États unis et Gandalf n'a pas vraiment le profil de George Bush.</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (Vanyaron)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jun 2003 21:57:00 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://www.jrrvf.com/fluxbb/viewtopic.php?pid=10041#p10041</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Réponse à&#160;:  LOTR  vs Iraq : détente]]></title>
			<link>https://www.jrrvf.com/fluxbb/viewtopic.php?pid=10040#p10040</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>Meme en tant qu'anglophone très anglais, je ne suis pas du tout convaincu par l'humour de ce morceau.<p>Je sais pas ce qui me dérange le plus: comparer L'Iraq au Mordor ou comparer la victoire de la "coalition of the willing" à celle réussie in extremis par le Gondor.<p>Greg, franchement attristé...</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (Tirno)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jun 2003 20:55:00 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://www.jrrvf.com/fluxbb/viewtopic.php?pid=10040#p10040</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Réponse à&#160;:  LOTR  vs Iraq : détente]]></title>
			<link>https://www.jrrvf.com/fluxbb/viewtopic.php?pid=10043#p10043</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p><br> Je suis tout a fait de l'avis de Claire, il nous faut prendre ce texte de manière entierement décalé....<p> C'est exactement comme "la guerre des etoiles" à l'époque de la guerre froide et la comparaison avec l'Empire du Mal sovietique (terme repris par l'administration Reagan)....<p> En lisant ce texte, j'essaye juste de m'imaginer les personnages principaux : <br><i>* Tony Blair en Aragorn et ses longs chveux bruns : ca donne plutot un vieux 68-tard adepte des Beatles ;o) <br>* Bush avec sa barbe blanche et ses habits de lumière (vision d'un meneur de secte ou d'un danseur de disco?) :o)</i><br>...quid de Frodo? :o(<p> .....maintenant que j'y pense, la vision de hordes d'orcs moustachus et barbus courant en djellabas, passant à l'attaque me fait me rouler par terre :o))<p>Remercions ce moment dedié à la reflexion à cet auteur qui est :&#160; <p>* soit completement embrigadé par la propagande et qui a voulu apporter sa petite pierre à l'édifice de la gloriole guerriere :o(<p>* soit fait preuve d'un humour efficace et propre à l'auto-derision de l'actualité....(il a quand meme utilisé la pseudo de Grima Womrtongue...c'est peut etre une indication de derision :o)<p> Helas, je ne suis pas assez anglophone pour vous faire un commentaire plus poussé, meme si je fais confiance en Tirno qui m'a l'air d'etre plus pointu en anglais....<p> Enfin, voila mon petit avis sur ce petit texte qui, heureusement, ne restera pas dans les annales litterraires...:o)<p>Namarië<br>Julien - Elwë<p>&#160; </p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (Elwe)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jun 2003 15:19:00 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://www.jrrvf.com/fluxbb/viewtopic.php?pid=10043#p10043</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Réponse à&#160;:  LOTR  vs Iraq : détente]]></title>
			<link>https://www.jrrvf.com/fluxbb/viewtopic.php?pid=10042#p10042</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>c'est à mettre en parallèle avec l'image de Bush portant l'Unique, qui circulait cet hiver<br>c'est le pb avec le vieux cliché opposant Bien et Mal absolu(s)en fantasy : le SDA est à la mode, et sert de support à tous les délires se référant à notre affligeante actualité.<br>je pense que c'est en référence à ce phénomène qu'il faut lire ce message, au second degré.<br>claire</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (Claire)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jun 2003 13:05:00 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://www.jrrvf.com/fluxbb/viewtopic.php?pid=10042#p10042</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[Réponse à&#160;:  LOTR  vs Iraq : détente]]></title>
			<link>https://www.jrrvf.com/fluxbb/viewtopic.php?pid=10039#p10039</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>ça a l'air cool, mais quelqu'un pourrait traduire svp ??</p>]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (kementari)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Wed, 18 Jun 2003 18:16:00 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://www.jrrvf.com/fluxbb/viewtopic.php?pid=10039#p10039</guid>
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			<title><![CDATA[LOTR  vs Iraq : détente]]></title>
			<link>https://www.jrrvf.com/fluxbb/viewtopic.php?pid=10038#p10038</link>
			<description><![CDATA[<p>bon je sais, l'intitulé est bizarre, mais attendez de lire le mail que je viens de recevoir (ci-dessous) pour comprendre...<p>amusez-vous bien (désolée pour les non-anglicistes):<p><br>End of War on Sauron raises more questions about its conduct and<br>necessity<p>Source : New Gondor Times<br>Grima Wormtongue<p>While the leaders of the alliance including Gandalf and Aragorn have<br>proclaimed a victory in the War on Sauron questions are increasingly<br>being raised about both the conduct of the war and itsnecessity.<p>Archeologists and historians have particularly bemoaned the loss of<br>priceless artifacts forever lost with the fall of Barad-dur, when<br>Sauron's fortress was destroyed. These artifacts reputed to date back<br>to the First Age have caused some in the archeological community&#160; to<br>condemn what they call the careless and thoughtless way the assault<br>on Mordor was handled.<p>Meanwhile months after the fall of Barad-Dur, the Alliance has failed<br>to capture either Sauron or the Ringwraiths. While the Captains of the<br>West claim that Sauron and all his works have perished, no body has<br>ever been found and there are reports that Sauron may be wandering on<br>the outskirts of Mirkwood in various disguises. This adds yet another<br>question to the many questions already being raised about the conduct<br>of the War on Sauron.<p>Military experts had already condemned the march to the Towers of the<br>Black Gate as a foolhardy maneuver conducted with too few troops and<br>point to the heavy casualties incurred during the sieges of Helm's<br>Gate and Gondor as evidence of the incompetence with which the War on<br>Sauron was handled.<p>Various questions have also been raised as to whether the War on<br>Sauron was even necessary in the first place.<p>"After Sauron's defeat at the hands of the Last Alliance he&#160; was in<br>no shape to mount any kind of assault on the West. His fortresses were<br>in ruins, his armies were demoralized and the only thing he wanted was<br>to recover a small piece of property, a trifle that was looted from<br>him by Allied troops during the former war," The Wizard Saruman had<br>argued, "A mere ring. If it had only been turned over to him, this<br>entire conflict could be avoided."<p>While Gandalf and others have argued that the so-called "One Ring"<br>would have singlehandedly allowed Sauron to crush the West, other<br>experts have questioned whether any ring could indeed have such<br>capabilities and suggested that the Ring was never actually recovered<br>after it had been lost by Isildur but that the leaders of the Alliance<br>had deceived the Peoples of the West into believing that Sauron was on<br>the verge of gaining possession of it in order to trigger a war with<br>Mordor. Alliance leaders have responded indignantly to such<br>accusations but nevertheless no real evidence bas been presented that<br>the One Ring even existed outside of the claims of a handful of<br>insiders at the Council of Elrond. Gandalf's insistence that the One<br>Ring has now been destroyed in the fires of Mount Doom has done little<br>to boost his credibility with a story that to many far too<br>conveniently disposes of the evidence before any objective parties<br>have had a chance to examine it.<p>"We kept hearing all the time about Sauron using this supposed ring<br>to enslave the free peoples of Middle Earth and now it turns out that<br>Sauron never even had this ring to begin with," Political activist<br>Bill Fenry said, "I feel deceived and lied to."<p>Many of those who had voiced opposition to war and pushed for a<br>peaceful settlement with Sauron have also questioned whether diplomacy<br>could have been used to avert a terrible conflict citing&#160; frequent<br>emmisaries from Mordor that were turned away by Rohan and Gondor<br>causing some to speculate on the motives of the Alliance leadership in<br>wanting to bring about an unnecessary war.<p>Mithril has been cited as one economic reason driving the conflict<br>with anti-war activists citing the assassination of Smaug and the<br>rebuffed Dwarven colonization of Moria combined with the sudden<br>appearance of Dwarves at the Council of Elrond as evidence of a<br>conspiracy aimed at allowing Dwarven interests to take control of<br>Mithril mines in the possession of Sauron leading to the slogan, 'No<br>Blood for Mithril.'<p>Others point to the widespread hostility towards Gondor and the<br>Western Lands, and particularly towards King Elessar and his policies<br>as proof that the War on Sauron has failed.<p>"Yes we may have defeated Sauron but now the Haradrim, the Southrons,<br>the Easterlings and the Orcs and Goblins hate us," Political analyst<br>Shelob said, "And what point is there in defeating a single Sauron<br>when our foreign policy causes us to be so hated that a thousand more<br>Saurons will rise in his place."<p>Particularly worrying to Shelob are polls that show that Orc hatred<br>of humans is at an all time high with over 90 percent of Orcs<br>expressing a desire to devour human flesh.<p>"We can't hope to defeat the Orcs with weapons. We must understand why<br>they hate us and what we can do to stop them from hating us and<br>wanting to eat our flesh. For example virtually every Orc surveyed has<br>expressed dissatisfaction with Gondor's foreign policy of killing Orcs<br>and overthrowing Sauron. Those are statistics we need to really pay<br>attention to."<p>One thing is certainly clear that with Sauron possibly still on the<br>loose,many people questioning whether the existence of the One Ring<br>wasn't a fraud meant to create support for an unjust war, the loss of<br>valuable archeological treasures at Barad-Dur, exposure of military<br>blunders by the alliance and continuing raids by Orcs and Goblins;<br>whether or not the so-called War on Sauron has ended in victory or<br>defeat remains in question.]]></description>
			<author><![CDATA[dummy@example.com (Claire)]]></author>
			<pubDate>Wed, 18 Jun 2003 18:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
			<guid>https://www.jrrvf.com/fluxbb/viewtopic.php?pid=10038#p10038</guid>
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